As requested by eloth, I have started to work on the Palace of Vivec based on the original concept for Morrowind. Nothing much to show yet, I just did 1.5h of work on it to get a feel of the challenges I will face, this post is here to say that I am working on it and am open to ideas from you guys.
Quick screenshot: https://imageshack.com/i/5bj3zjj
My body is ready, JK.
I'm really interested in what you come up with jk :)
I'm not really very familiar with how it looked in the original game but I think a theme of water would look pretty cool. With waterfall kinda things going down the sides and maybe some fountains?
here are the concepts Hiero did for us, very useful, very pretty too
http://tesrenewal.com/files/vivec's_palace.jpg
http://tesrenewal.com/files/vivec's_palace_mk.jpg
Vivec - I worked previously on the High Fane, this is the Palace of Vivec.
Tajnarasha - I will never look at your avatar the same way again :D
Made some progress on the main shape, and will add canal and water themed details soon.
https://imageshack.com/i/jtckiqj
Looks nice jk, but I really like the concept that Hiero made, maybe you could get a little closer to that?
I disagree mspeed101 I think JK's looks better then the concept.
[edit] Actually the concepts are pretty similar to the model.
I agree, I think the main thing is that your model has to great of a slope; bringing it down to the level of hiero's concept art will make it look much better imho.
Yeah, my main concern was that it looks too high and too many layers imo. I do like some of the design features of the Hiero's concept but that was my main problem.
To all - I used the original concept by MK - http://michaelkirkbride.tumblr.com/post/73228726965/vivecs-palace
Please do post your thoughts about this - should I try to recreate MK's concept or Hiero's concept? Somewhere in between? Neither?
Personally I would prefer to use MK's concept because Hiero's concept leaves us with the same relatively undetailed palace option that Morrowind had. While I think Hiero's concept is very good looking, I think it does not fully take advantage of Skyrim's increased rendering engine capabilities (which is the whole reason we are doing this, right? :P )
I would say that you should go for something in between the two now that I saw MK's concept, and add some new ideas to freshen it up and take advantage of the engine. Maybe it should have less straight edges and some more exotic curvature, not sure.
I'm waitin new model :)) and what with High Fane?
Iniquity - High Fane still needs texturing, but eloth wanted me to start working on the palace first.
So I have made two concepts so far, showing only the front side, and would like to hear the public opinion about them. Do you prefer the first, second or neither?
First - https://imageshack.com/i/b51lpvj (missing a ladder for ascension)
Second - https://imageshack.com/i/n67ukyj (needs more work on smoothing the sharp angles)
second design is a winner
Oh god lets not leave to this a vote we'll be here all year.
Eloth happy digi meh, this is no longer a democracy, agree on 2nd one ;)
#2 respects the original idea of a pyramid a lot better than the first in my opinion. The sense of scale is also monstrous - this thing is going to be massive!!! Fitting for a god :D
2nd one by far, it looks so amazing!
The second, definitely. That said, the first one shouldn't be discounted, it's really cool. I love the emphasis on the puzzle canal.
Seeeeccooondddd - can't wait to see it rounded!
second with rounded corners :)
Personally, I think it should look like that:
[External image]
It's great idea, to improve Morrowind even further that just carry it over to new engine, but new palace is tooooo far from LORE. Using original Bethesda arts - the best way to make Morrowind look like it should.
Lazlow, while I understand your point, the goal of the project, as I see it, is to create the world of Morrowind as Bethesda would have done it with today's computer capabilities. If the processing power of 2014 was available back at 2004, they would have scrapped all of Vivec exterior architecture in favour of something more interesting and detailed while maintaining the established general features from books and concepts. If you want a pure Morrowind experience, Morrowind Graphics Overhaul already gives you precisely that, there is no need to repeat work that is already done.
On a side note, I recently tried out Dragonborn, and I am very happy to see that Beth did not just copy everything from Bloodmoon 1:1, and introduced new elements to Solstheim. I, for one, was happy that I was not just replaying a 2012 version of a 2004 world.
On another side note - the concept art you posted from Hieronymus7Z - he actually added the 8 planets floating above the palace, as described in the lore, while Bethesda did not do it in their final design. If that does not tell you that Beth could not achieve with their 2004 engine everything they wanted, then I don't know what will :P
jkLazlow, while I understand your point, the goal of the project, as I see it, is to create the world of Morrowind as Bethesda would have done it with today's computer capabilities. If the processing power of 2014 was available back at 2004, they would have scrapped all of Vivec exterior architecture in favour of something more interesting and detailed while maintaining the established general features from books and concepts. If you want a pure Morrowind experience, Morrowind Graphics Overhaul already gives you precisely that, there is no need to repeat work that is already done.
Totally agree with the goal of the project, I see it the same way as you do. I think it's a really great idea to recreate Vivec into something mind-blowing, as it described in books and concepts. However, why do we need to change this huge epic stairway to the palace onto some strange zigzags? It looks a lot less appropriate for the Vivec palace, in my opinion.
jkOn another side note - the concept art you posted from Hieronymus7Z - he actually added the 8 planets floating above the palace, as described in the lore, while Bethesda did not do it in their final design. If that does not tell you that Beth could not achieve with their 2004 engine everything they wanted, then I don't know what will :P
Yeah, that's the thing, he took original Bethesda work and added to it from Lore, from the books and concepts, as you mentioned earlier. I'm happy with all the changes that Skywind makes compared to the original Morrowind game, such as new armors (two types of ebony armors, for example), clothes system, voice acting and stuff. Perhaps, I just didn't like your version of the palace, but you've done a lot of great work and I thank you for what you're one of those people that help our dream called "Skywind" become a reality. I'm sorry for being too critical.
Lazlow
The work on the palace only started. If you look at his work on the High Fane, you'll see there is still a lot of things waiting ahead for what JK will be able to make out of it. I'm sure the current temple is a template for what will eventually be the final structure. Wait and see ;)
even some published original concept arts very differ from final style of game.
EDITED: I did not understand at first role of green orbs.
However, why do we need to change this huge epic stairway to the palace onto some strange zigzags? It looks a lot less appropriate for the Vivec palace, in my opinion.
I did it for technical reasons - the art leaders of the project wanted every level of the palace to be walkable (and told me to implement that, or else.. :P ), and as a result I needed to either break up the continuity of the central staircase into smaller segments followed by a small flat platform, or redo the stair design altogether in favour of a design that allows easy access to each terrace level. I chose the latter and tried to implement it in my version of the model, thinking that it would be more appropriate. If you think this could have been avoided with a different, better solution, I am willing to make a third version for comparison.
JK, perhaps there could be a set of stairs that run along the center of the pyramid, leading to the palace chamber by removing the pillars that stand in the way? If you maintain the accesses to the sides it shouldn't impact the idea that the devs had in mind while also making a scenic, more direct pathway to the top of the structure.
Yeah, what Taj said ^
I was just about to post the same :)
I'm with Lazlow. Its true that back in the day Beth couldn't do what they envisioned because of limited tech. The concept art for Vivec is very different from what we saw in game. We have a chance to bring the old concept art to life. Why deviate so much from it and the original? Many of us have fond memories of climbing that big central stair to the palace for the first time and looking up at the big door, wondering what lies behind it. Your new concept strikes me as some kind of obstacle course. Its all very symmetrical and doesn't have that alien and organic feel of the official concepts. I would be sad to see such an iconic landmark not follow such a great official concept.
DMKW - I will remake the second concept with a straight staircase, give me some time.
About the edginess of the current version - it is a WIP (hence the thread name), and I will make it smoother later in the work, simply because it slows down the initial work on the shape 10x if you want to make it smooth right from the start. Have faith in me, I will get the organic feel right :)
Regarding the memories of the original - my ideal goal would be that by exploring Skywind you would make new memories, just as good as the old ones. And if I fail at that, hopefully someone else will make a better version of the palace.
alysandereven some original concept arts very differ from final style of game.
so better to save general idea of Baar Dau as one object.
That's a Telvanni tower, not Vivec's palace.
I know. It's example of conception change.
For some reason I thought anyone see them, it was way more overrated.
Now will edit post.
In that case, where did you get the idea that Baar Dau was going to be in multiple pieces? The orbs floating above Vehk's Palace are representative of the plane(t)s of Mundus, entirely separate entities from the Ministry of Truth.
Yeah? Curiouser and curiouser!
I think IN building is more suitable place.
whether it will be enough organically and arts (especially from afar)?
Guys, sorry for the lack of progress, my university studies are fully consumed all free time for the near foreseeable future. I will return to this model when the university gives me a break :)
alysander, you are absolutely wrong, that is not a tower neither palace, um not going to debate with you
Update after a long while.
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Awesome! Very good mix of old and new!
Good progress! Are you planning to have statues on the flat-topped plinths?
Can't wait to see it textured
My only suggestion- make the side ramps go all the way down so that the player can traverse to the canals with greater ease. Looks great!
Sorry, but no statues are planned, they will kill the PCs that run the game. Also, properly connected and detailed stairs between levels are coming soon, when I get the main shape accepted.
Another progress shot, with minor, but significant modifications. I took the idea of Hieronymus to have spikes and vents on the main ramp, and lifted the ramp higher.
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Vivec is gonna shit all over other cities ;)
back to the lazlow thing, it is notable the the original concept for the temple is pretty much exactly like the heironymus one -which i love-
All the cool guys are doing fancy renders now, well I want to be cool too! :P
A shot with almost representative smoothing groups for the platforms.
Saivryn - I like the original concept too, but I am following the design vision of eloth. we tend to disagree on things, but he has the final say in any disputes we have had so far and the results speak about wisdom in his leadership :)
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So.... grand....
One WIP of railings and staircases coming up.
The vertex count of the model has reached 25k, I am getting worried if I will be able to squeeze in the level of detail that I want to.
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| palace_of_vivec_14.jpg | 1.16 MB |
Christ that's pretty.
![[External image]](https://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/920x642q90/547/kqgb.jpg){kind=link}
![[External image]](http://cs606817.vk.me/v606817111/2b80/nhGG5V3xp1E.jpg){kind=link}
![[External image]](http://i61.tinypic.com/ual93.jpg){kind=link}
Didn't you already finish
Didn't you already finish this in another thread?