Sorry for the new thread. I know that there are at least 2 threads on the spear topic, but i couldnt find them and also searched for them with the search function and still no result.
so this dude managed to make working animations for spears. wuhhu great, you guys also managed to do that, so what is my point?
my point is: he does not replace any currently used skyrim animation! his spears use his new animations while other weapons will use their respective animation! they still do look a bit wonky but he seems to make progress and also posts about bugs he encounters and how he fixes them in the thread at the nexus forums. so what that means is we have really WORKING animations for spears.
http://forums.nexusmods.com/index.php?/topic/1462112-spear-a...
oh cmon by the nine i am blind -.- sorry for cluttering the forums i found the original forum thread..
YES! YES!
Yes. Yes! Yes!
I'm not getting excited until I know exactly how this works. Depending on the method he's using there could be some really annoying downsides.
If he's found a way to legitimately add new actor values, or found a way to bypass them entirely without any weird side effects like would be present with scripted animation swapping, then I can get behind this 200%.
I saw it ! I DAMN SAW IT ITS NOT A DREAM ! ITS A MIRACLE !
This truly opens a new world of possibilities damn i cant still believe you made it! Everyone waited so F*ing long for this but finally we will have it, I cant wait to impale some guys!!!
Think of the finishers, too!
I asked him the direct question : new AVs or he just changed the animations for a current weapon class.
He already stated that he replaced no anims. It is unique, but in one of the video's when he is equipping the spear it appears to equip as a two handed sword then changes to the throwing spear stance. So I dont believe he is using a new weapon type. I have a theory about how to get new weapon types into the game without actually adding new weapon types. I believe he might have implemented it the way I was thinking.
Scripting?
Anyway as far as the animations go, i'd prefer better Sojutsu then Greek spear and shield fighting style.
Wouldn't that be just a placeholder animation until he finds a proper one for it?
Dragomir wrote:
Are you asking me ?
It was a reply to what Ehamloptrian pointed out, more of an assumption than question though.
And on a side note, I don't think Sojutsu would really work in Skyrim context, would be weird to see nords move like ninjas.
Dragomir wrote:
Sojutsu, has nothing to do with ninjas, it's a style that uses both hands in wielding the spear compared to the 1-h presented in the video.
But both can be amazing if animated accordingly :
- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c5hZeYRp05U
- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Hd4UAXsnuA or http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O8RWLxlzTiM
Styles of Spear martial arts for animations are unimportant at the moment, what is important here is finding out how he's making this mod, so that if it is a viable method with few to no negative side effects, a similar method can be used for Spears and Halberds in Skywind and Skyblivion.
Dragomir wrote:
It may be, but if you look carefully, there seems to be a delay in equipping animations changing, so I have a feeling that reveals how he is doing it, some kind of scripting.
Which is part of my theory which includes editing the behavior graph to further split the states under two handed weapons and using some modifiers to set a value within the behavior graph via papyrus (Send Animation Event - to call an event to modify a value) which will allow the use of custom animations for same weapon types, ie. You could put spears as a two handed weapon, throw a script onto the weapon which will make it a unique sub weapon type. This method could be used to create any number of custom weapon types.
Jorgen, as explained above, I have a theory that when I get a chance I will try, we also have people investigating SKSE to see if we can extend to the weapon types list, so in the end the only help the above would be, if the guy is willing to share everything he has done thus far (Which I doubt)
The videos convinced me further that this style of fighting, as most of japanese martial arts is way too complex and showy to work with Skyrim's athmosphere. But if you have a motion capture studio in your basement feel free to animate those :P
My theory proved correct. I am able to create new weapon types as a sub weapon type of another. So spears would be a sub two handed weapon with its own unique set of animations. The video below shows two "Two handed Weapons" with a different Equip and Idle animation set
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BzqpBc4MrAMXejl2RTBlQlpQemM...
Ehamloptiran is hitting all our bug-bears out of the ball park! Now we need animators.
Is that 0.2?
Are there any limits to the animations you can add in?
As of right now I wouldnt be able to add in new types of attacks, only add new animations for existing attack types, like left attack, right attack, etc. But there should be no limitations to the types of weapon anims that can be put in (So any type of weapon). I have only started to scratch the surface of what is possible.
wow we do not only have a guy on the nexus finally managing to make functioning spears but also someone from the team!
Any chance you could make a tutorial for us plebeians? I really want to play around with that. I have so many ideas that could possibly work now thanks to this.
Ehamloptiran words cannot describe how awesome you are.
This is truely exciting! My Dunmer is never complete without his spear ;)
Whoa. Seriously? This is good stuff. :)
so now with this new discovery is it possible to make throwing weapons ass well?
Yes it is. I just need some animations for throwing weapons and I can add it to my prototype. I am working on some terrible animations when i can, so I can showcase it.
great to hear! now just i chappy said we just need quality animators
What about first person animations?
well from what i know if the animation fit perfectly on third person it will look fine on first person
Knowing the way things work around here nothing's being left out, especially not something as important as first person animations. It's just a matter of the behaviors being sorted out, and then the animators making everything.
The vanilla first person would require more work on Eham's part. As the first person has it's own behavior file that would need to be patched with the animations and weapon sub type. It would also require it's own set of animations because the first person skeleton/model doesn't include the entire body and the came works differently. This knowledge came when I worked on the first person enhanced mod, now known as the joy of perspective. Not saying it's impossible I'm just saying it's gonna come later. If you would like to use the spears in the first person after a release gets done, as I don't see the first person being a thing in the initial release, I would recommend using the immersive FP mod as it's a pseudo first person mod that will work with what ever animations.
ty for clearing everything, i had no idea the animations were separated,well anyway i going to take a look on the mod you recommended me
Eham
Could you try to make a stand alone spear mod using the method you described? You can use my 2h stabbing animations from here:
http://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/53455/?
Thanks!
h1zchan
@h1zchan: Eham's been trying to get animations for a while now, it's awesome that you've appeared with some already made. Maybe finally this can materialize. It's just a matter of waiting for him to return from whatever he's been doing. :D
Just need some new kill cams and 1st person animations then?
h1zchan these may be helpful. Eham I'm afraid is out of commission for a while though. But we could for sure use these for getting the spear system implemented. 1st person animations will be needed. But we may (and this is a big maybe) make 1st person with a 3rd person camera which will make things easier. But time can only tell if this will have a good effect.
Can someone point me to a tutorial on how to make 1st person animations? I've tried numerous methods but never had any success making those
bumping to let you guys know that the author of the spear mod is still making progress. he states: "I've just made some nifty spear related loading screens.... Not long to wait now folks
".
http://forums.nexusmods.com/index.php?/topic/1462112-spear-a...
Zatar is going to have a handful of alternate weapon animations in his character behavior overhaul, spear, short sword, dagger, etc. Plus we're currently working on our own system. I'll happen... eventually just wait.
Looks absolutely great, all the animation really needs is more "umph" to follow through with the thrust. Still, really excited to finally be able to use a spear again.
I get the feeling Soolie's mod isn't as efficient as Eham's method. There seems to be a sort of delay when he equips his weapons, and odd movements with the left hand, as if it's grasping an invisible weapon. The trouble is, Eham is gone, and Alex seems to be MIA, so that one seems to be the only spear functionality that's making any progress.
Soolie's mod is up on Nexus now. Any tech/animation guys might want to look into it for research purposes.
Click Here
Did you see his 26 step installation instruction? A mod should have 3 steps, unpack,copy past and activate. Soolie's mod is not user friendly, we can not point players to something like that to support the use of spears.
He also only has one handed spears, which only do unique animations in power attacks. (though javelins appear to use entirely unique animations)
That aside, I think it's worth studying to find out how his mod works, and to see if any of his methods might be usable by anyone working on spears/throwing here.
This is really not my area, but if he has been able to get new animations into the game isn't this the big issue, rather than just replacing existing animations?
Regardless of the quality of his animations/if they're one handed two handed that's not the issue because we wouldn't be using his animations. I thought I heard talk about having our own animations already (but I wouldn't swear by it, not my area again). If so, it's just a matter of getting them in-game as non-replacements. This mod may have the answer from what Jorgen's initial scouting seems to indicate..
Edit: on further review, it looks very clunky in terms of how he's getting it in-game, I feel like it's moreso than it needs to be. In the .esp it still uses the "onehanded" animation type, so he's doing a real workaround with running scripts in conjunction with other animation mods. Still there's a base of an idea here which could probably be cleaned up. I haven't looked at the scripts yet.
I don't think we need our own weapon handling system, all we need is to be compatible with the best system out there.
Why don't we replace swords with spears? They're just swords. In the real world battlefields they were usually outnumbered by spears 1 to 100, and most swordsmen had a polearm as the main weapon.
Alright, just taking a piss, but spears are a big deal to many people. It'd be really worth it to get them to work.
Spears were a part of Morrowind, not to mention the proper implementation of spears would be a massive innovation in Skyrim modding in general. It's understandable to not put it at a higher priority to much of the other work going on in Skywind, but I don't see any reason why it shouldn't be attempted. I mean, if you really want to minimize the work, why make new clothing and armor? Why not just use Skyrim's existing assets for Imperial and Nordic architecture? Besides, there's only maybe 2 people actively working on spears/halberds and throwing weapons, if at all. (also spears could open up new possibilities in other areas, such as creatures)
You do not understand what I am trying to say. All Skywind needs to do is include spears and being compatible with those mods.
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