Kwama Cave Concepts | Morroblivion

[Edited]

Yeah, I know we have already topic, but I wanted to create another one to keep everything clear. Termites were inspiration for me. On Gnisis concept they had similar structure. I think original idea was wandering around that, so I used it.

Before you comment read the whole first post.

Floor for tunnels as separate asset. Then you have more freedom in manipulating environment and use original tunnels too. Notice white areas: just trodden path.

Straight 2. version could have two variants just to differentiate and avoid repeating. Of course then we can have some rocks on it too by using b. asset beneath as base

1. walls 2. walls and ceiling. It could have two versions too.

a. c. d. e. f. are just to add some variations, texture similar to 1.

Of course for convenience we can create additional asset combined floor and ceiling.

Floor for hall, and addition samples to create some "paths" just to break repeatability. There is also, possibility to create some levels.

I always was wandering what they eat, sitting all time underground. So I took again ants and termites references again and I created fungus garden.

I just created "kwama honey" deposits

They can be attached to walls, floor, ceiling, whatever, just they should be reachable for kwama workers.

Kwama live in different environments so depends on what they eat they have 3 variations just with different color b. (Ashlands, combined kwama saliva and ash) a. (Bitter Coast) and top one for the rest. Of course only one type in one region.

It would be great to add some animated texture on that. Some floating particles inside.

1. 2. 3. 4. 5. are just examples of shapes.

0.a Is empty after infesting by forager 0.b infested by forager 0.c normal one

1. Is platform with two types of entries, of course everything modular. Cross section shows how it works.

2. 3. are kwama nests. One for particular example, second for more.

4. Are just bigger examples to fill up empty space like in Kwama: tunnels ceiling with similar texture. IV is just mud wall.

Like termites have ventilation system, they have too.

1. 2. 3. show how it looks like in cross section. One of them have more holes, some of them only one. some of assets can give some dim light which can give really cool effects.

a. (one way) b.(multi-ways) are just proposition how some vents could look like. and A. B. are just examples how texture look like.

cross section of chamber just give idea how it works. Some vents in interior, another in exterior.

1.a 1.b 1.c it is just addon to cave (it should fit kwama interiors too). In this video it show how I image it in game.

1. A are just some glowing parasites. It could be on it but it is not necessary. Just another cool light effects.

2. 2.b 2.c 2.d are kwama slime. They need sth ugly and sticky (it would be cool feature with slowing down player)

2.a is my kwama chandelier. My dream it is to has some caustic or reflections but The same asset is good enough.

So we have then sticky, alien enviroment.

1. Kwama egg 2. empty sack 3. kwama claster 4. small kwama eggs 5. small kwama eggs empty nest

From time to time it can show some slow animation. In best option when you are close enough and randomly in default state. Animation is really simple but and I don't know if we can add some good trigger to it. (only for big ones)

Just sth similar like ants in skyrim.If it can glow, it would be supergreat. I think this is just some png. sequence. Simple movement on path with right, left small rotation. Maybe it can be done in aftereffects. I'm not sure how it was done in game. Very optional thing but cool to have it. Why we have it? It could be just some symbiosis or commensalism.

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The main problem with kwama mines is that they look like really similar. Termites are diversity group so we can do it the same with kwama. From primitive forms to more complex. Kwama can get some unique coloration for particular spiecies but this optional too.

1. Most primitive, small colonies have only assets with kwama eggs

2. kwama eggs and sticky things

3. kwama eggs, sticky things, some mushrooms but without fungus garden structures.

4. kwama eggs, hall floor, tunnels floor, tunnels ceiling, (gathering version)

5. kwama eggs, hall floor, tunnels floor, tunnels ceiling, fungus garden (dry version)

6. kwama eggs, hall floor, tunnels floor, tunnels ceiling, sticky things, fungus garden (humid version)

7. kwama eggs, hall floor, tunnels floor, tunnels ceiling, fungus garden, ventilation system (dry version)

8. kwama eggs, hall floor, tunnels floor, tunnels ceiling, sticky things, fungus garden, ventilation system (humid version)

9. kwama eggs, hall floor, tunnels floor, tunnels ceiling, fungus garden, ventilation system, hall structures (dry version)

10. kwama eggs, hall floor, tunnels floor, tunnels ceiling, sticky things, fungus garden, ventilation system, hall structures (humid version)

We have then a lot of versions for 32 kwama mines.

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It sounds like a lot of assets but it is modular addon, so if we don't have enough workforce we can just implement more basics assets.

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I will add some "layout" concepts how I imagine it in game, with light, mist and so on, so stay tuned.

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Are kwama models done? Maybe create some species versions? In all cases just with changed texture patterns.

So I wait for feedback and what are your ideas on it.

Last edited by lukkar on 6 Feb 2015 - 07:59.

This is really well thought

This is really well thought through. There are only two things I'd probably avoid.

First is glowing bugs or fungi, maybe with the exception of Bitter Coast. There's no need to add so many Christmas lights to these caves, unless it's subtle and unique. I'm all for saliva and sticky things though, they'd probably look cool enough reflecting light from torches and so on. And of course glowing eggs, since these were in the original. The idea with glowing beetles walking on paths like ants is cool, but I would much rather use these for Bitter Coast exterior.

Second is the fungi farms. Kwama workers and warriors feed on what foragers bring to the nest. Foragers go out and hunt/scavenge, then digest it. Some of it they use for their own nutrition, some of it they vomit in the nest when they get back to it all full and fat. I think you could actually edit the fungus concept to be a food sack made of kwama cuttle (saliva wax, don't confuse with scuttle, which is a bug jelly meat), similar to how bees keep the honey. Imagine a mass of waxy membrane bubbles full of fluid forager vomit, bundled up on walls like grapes for the workers to eat from :D That's not too dissimilar to your concept actually.

Oh, and don't forget there are two types of Kwama eggs, big and small. Scribs hatch from the big ones, foragers from the small ones.

Also, we could use some ideas on how the mer-made structures in the mines correspond with Kwama assets, so we could use some concepts for scaffolding, clutter and other props ;)

Hmm, which would be the biggest Kwama hive? I'd assume the one in Gnisis? We could maybe expand it and come up with some fun stuff for it :D Really have it run deep into the ground and find more and more stuff as we go deeper, to unlit, unexplored and unexploited parts.

As an 3ds artist all I can

As an 3ds artist all I can really say is holy crap call me impressed and slap me with a fish. These concepts are seriously impressive, and your depictions of the tiling assets even more so!

Have you thought about making textures for the enviroments team?

[

[External image]

Im also a huge fan of the slimy stuff. Looks fantastic

Best post ever by lukkar.

Best post ever by lukkar. seriously impressed.

Im personally for the glowing scribs only due to the lighting effect it gives, rather than lore.

Everything else looks right.
will be up to artist to make sure the assets and textures make it look like melted rock.

Also, this inspired me to

Also, this inspired me to finally whip out some Kwama creature concepts. Or rather just one for now, the worker: [External image]

Colour me impressed Lukkar!

I really like the fungus combs. I also really like the ventilation system and sticky webs.

I think if we create some of these it will go a long way.

The tileset could be done with applying the right textures to our replacement tileset, but obviously something custom would be great.

So it comes down to a decision. Do we have the resources to create the tileset? Not my call, I'm not a modeler. Please let me know if I should carry on using the Skyrim templates as replacements, or should hold off until somebody makes an executive decision on how we carry forward. Obviously the downside to waiting is that its another project in limbo.

I look forward to what you guys decide.

@Dragomir

Yeap fungi farms don't fit. I like this idea (mainly from anesthetic point of view) but it is a bit lore breaking. I think your conept could be good too and even more alien. About eggs small kwamas could be in packs like in waterbug example.

[External image]

About scaffolding I thought about that it would be artificial structures man-made structures like in bee-farming. Then you have distinction between domesticated and wild hives. I'm not sure but probably only several kwama mines are habited by ppl

It would be great to create some excel file with notification which cave have assets sets.

If you create front side concept and left/right or 3/4 view it could be easier to add some colors to this. I mean template for species variations.

@ErikChristensen

Ohhh [External image]...

Main texture (mud) was provided by Rav. It was too good to not use, so I used it. I can do everything buddy when I have enough time. The problem with that I don't have experience in textures, so my workflow is so, so, and other things is that I don't know exactly what types of textures can skyrim handle (diffuse, normal map, specular, alfa... what next?) and some technique things like size and so on. But, if it would be some place to create some sets, I can try. But this is one action to learn sth and it is more about the future.

@Ravanna

Thanks buddy!

Maybe instead of bugs (I really want sth disturbing) sth like that.

About melted rock, I was thinking more like mud combined with kwama saliva. I'm still not sure how do you want to do melted rocks for all kinds of caves. But If you are eager to work [External image]

@GrumpyCat

Until it is modular, it is always space to do less or more.

Nice kwama @Drago! looks like

Nice kwama @Drago! looks like it resonance with my on 91%
@lukkar: i already made small passive creature for this type of insect.
Maybe Grumpy will include them eventually.

https://tesrenewal.com/files/alysander/images/tick.JPG
https://tesrenewal.com/files/alysander/images/root_tick.JPG

I don't know why but second

I don't know why but second link doesn't work properly. But I like it. Maybe it is just too dull, so I've done speed overpainting

Just add some contras and maybe differ a bit surface and I think it would be good (for me). But it depends on scale.

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Btw. I've done update

this is what i loved most

[External image] this is what i loved most about the kwama

[External image]

Some scaffolding, Just like

Some scaffolding, Just like farms, they design kwama mines to get more efficient output. So it is mainly for Gnisis in which I see it as most "advanced" mine and pearl of empire. This mine in my humble opinion should be in some places much larger.

All assets are from MW, so I see it as one big queen layer with with some mining platform on the center. They need only eggs, not honey. Eggs are on the ground, so they set planks like in apiary, just to create some artificial base to place nest where they want to. They have also footbridge to not walking in the mess on the ground and don't disturb kwama at work. It would be looking like one big biologic factory. They have also dump side to feed colony. Maybe cave will not big as Akula Chan chamber, but similar size. Of course on the walls will be kwama platforms and "honey" like in my previous concepts. In the center will be several vents. So the overall it should be pretty epic.

Of course if someone want it we can add some additional path and shacks. But it depends on level designers.

We will have crane for Vivec, so I don't see point to not to have in gnisis. It will add some additional scale of project.

Just again footbridge to not enter into kwama mess.

footbridges will be only for sticky ones caves, there is no reason to add them for "dry" and also for small. Of course biggest mines will have carts, smaller not.

I will do gnisis kwama queen nest concept and maybe some smaller wild one.

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In this way we have almost every mine unique, which we can't say about original MW.

I think it need some eggs or

I think it need some eggs or other resource placed on walls then.
Maybe root gallery with this kind of ticks as food source for kwama.

Has their been any

Has their been any consideration to make Kwama nests a sort of dungeon? I remember playing Morrowind and having absolutely no reason to visit Kwama egg mines since I don't really need restore fatigue potions and that's all they're good for. Perhaps there could be a radiant quest setup where bandits will capture an egg mine and you have to clear it out for the workers who can reward you with leveled gold. Another way to take it to have some egg mines lead into old rooms with loot which could be guarded by a leveled Kwama guardian (basically a beefed up version of the Kwama warrior). You can take it any direction you want though but I don't think anyone can complain about more dungeons on Vvardenfell except perhaps the purists but they wouldn't approve of half this stuff to begin with.

no1 wrote:

no1
[External image] this is what i loved most about the kwama

[External image]

Don't see your point, since we're keeping it very similar way:
[External image]

hohoho i really like those

hohoho i really like those kwamas there Dragomir!

looks perfect i just had the

[External image] looks perfect i just had the [External image] because what the noobs of elder scroll online did whit the kwama the just so wierd and that why i love them in morrowind

1 thing could the arms be remade a littel so that the got primitive claws love the digging axe arms

@Drago

nice, Now I wait for color version ;)

@alysander

Root gallery fits more to Bitter Coast in my humble opinion. I will think of that. On walls I will add "kwama honey".

Main source of food, I think it will be gathered by miners, you know just fattening kwama. Maybe they will get another entrance just above kwama, so kwama will have own one. In MW we didn't have eggs on walls. Also Kwama don't walk on walls, so they will fell into abyss or it will be not save for them after birth.

More meat

Loving the athmosphere on

Loving the athmosphere on these ones.

You really outdid yourself...

You really outdid yourself... I need to lay down.

Cant wait to check these out,

Cant wait to check these out, they look outstanding. The atmosphere of the caves look so good i will actually want to go in there and look around all of them! I also really like the attention to detail Lukkar that you grabbed from other such colonial bugs we have to use as a base concept, wel done.

(No subject)

Kwama worker with egg and queen on back.

@ lukkar: model readiness are:

0. (V) Eggs: i have prototypes.
1. (V) Scrib: model is ready. Wait for rigging by Batmanna. Rig/prototype: spider.
2. (+) Cocoon: sculpt is made on 50%. Rig/prototype: chaurus cocoon (DB).
3. (+) Scavenger: sculpt is made on 50%. Rig/prototype: chaurus.
4. (V) Worker/soldier: sculpt is finished by me. Need some further work by Ravanna. Rig/prototype: bear.
5. (V) Queen: queen parts are need complete worker and instructions how is that possible to make models look as one whole.

A. Forager: looks like it's complete made by Ravanna. Not sure about rigging. Rig/prototype: horker.

they look neat!

Is that kwama pooping on the

Is that kwama pooping on the other one?

@Jazzman90: worker is placing

@Jazzman90: worker is placing egg in it's place. On the back there is queen.
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BW vers

Male/scavenger kwama concept. This is proposed new caste of kwama middle between scrib and workers.
It could inhabit lands outdoor of nest and upper levels of caves and function of them is dead bodies scavenging and hunt small animals to get protein food for it's family.

Ahhh ok! Sry for not seeing

Ahhh ok! Sry for not seeing that, didn't mean to sound impolite![External image]

Eggs cluster: what if combine

Eggs cluster: what if combine idea of 'kwama honey deposits' and kwama eggs? Then you can place them on walls, and use one model as honey vessel and base for eggs, that feed on it. Also IMO eggs must be more insect - more close to scrib form.

I changed this one. Now I

I changed this one. Now I treat forager as symbiotic "parasite" bringing up by kwamas. Another specie breeding in other place. It makes more sense than taking them from eggs. It can be some kind of trap like falmer pod or dwarven Scuttle too. But not all of course.

From all traps which we have here I will add flammable gas, trap-oil, poison gas. Then it is more interesting.

@Jazz

Now, all your sins are forgiven.

@alysander

Eggs can't be insect like because they supposed to be more like real eggs.

Your example could sth be like balut

[External image]

which can be used as some weird dunmer cuisine, but this is so optional, I don't mind if it would be or not.

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And those shapes could be good as bases for eggs for some smaller caves

vanilla have small eggs (

vanilla have small eggs (~with lesser embryo) and big eggs (~with developed embryo) for this case of difference.
also flesh of such living thing as scrib must be sloppy as chicken jelly itself.

In first and second case it

In first and second case it has shell.

of course: most insect stages

of course: most insect stages have shell

what maby also would be cool

what maby also would be cool if u got a big scribe and make hime inta a cocoon where a kwama worker comes out like those chaurus cocoons from dawngaurd dlc and got 2 or 3 around vardenfell so u just knowe o that where the workers comes from

Btw.

About kwama layer, queen's abdomen could be longer, more or less like in alysander concept. If it is not problem for bigger colonies could be even 2-3 times longer/bigger.

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I remember that happy found nice example of... sth

[External image]

Semi-transparent saliva whatever. Sth like that is good for inner structure. Not so glowing, more similar like in my third concept. Combined with 6. 7. 8. it could give really cool effects. It can appear as some weird pseudo rooms structures too.

Awesome, I like most of these

Awesome, I like most of these concepts, specially this:

"Kwama live in different environments so depends on what they eat they have 3 variations just with different color b. (Ashlands, combined kwama saliva and ash) a. (Bitter Coast) and top one for the rest. Of course only one type in one region."

I totally agree in that point, the current kwama models we have, that are really ok, sometimes it looks like they don't much really good with the "green" mold or the "grey" volcanic. If there could be some way to change their colour a bit, according to the kind of cave the kwama is located, that could be really helpful to increase the variety and even make kwama more beliaveble. From my point of view, for kwamas it should be easier to grow in a mold environment than a volcanic one.

On the other hand, in MW kwama mines are kind of boring :S at least to me....... not only because they are all the same, but there is nothing useful there, no loot at all, and combat is not a challenge there.

So, and this is my opinion, we should do something to make them more interesting, visually right now I think we have achieved a lot, but we can make them even better if the assets and the ambience could be different in each kind of cave, I'm not talking about doing new 3d models of course, just find an easy way to get that.

Finally, I don't know if we can do something more in wild and blighted kwama caves, like a big and hard combat vs the queen (I actually think that's happening right now following the current kwama dessigns we have) and to get some interesting loot there, I don't know how I must say.... but something rewarding would be good and above all, doesn't remaking what we have, just adding.

How is it going? I seen only

How is it going? I seen only some really disappointing assets with spider silk.

> to make them more interesting
what about my proposition to make root galleries with glowing insects?