Censorship in Skywind aka Molag's Balls

To be honest, these games aren't really marketed to older people - they try to do that, but they don't succeed. Fallout on the other hand is completely different - I played FO3 when it came out when I was 13 and I didn't like it much, but when I turned 15 I loved it. TES games on the other hand, I played Oblivion when I was 11 and loved it. So to be honest, TES games are for older children and above.

Clearly its not marketed at a younger audience with the ratings. Bethesda would have spent an enormous amount of time considering what their market would be. Seems that they hit a good spot with the PEGI 18, sales didn't hurt.

18? Wow...

I thought they were pretty obviously marketed toward older people: their setting, heavy dialogue and rich RPG elements clearly indicate a more in-depth, slower placed game; something usually reserved for people mature enough to enjoy.

When I said "teenagers" I did mean 15+, but even if younger children play them, that's their parent's problem. Age ratings exist for a reason, so no one should truly get upset if mature content appears in a mature game.

And really; this is pretty light in terms of what is considered "mature."

Bottom line, TES games don't feel like they are for mature audiences.

Bottom line, TES games don't feel like they are for mature audiences.

Don't make me get Denvir to do a content dump of mature content involved in Morrowind! I think the website capacity is something like 15TB.

happychappy

Bottom line, TES games don't feel like they are for mature audiences.

Don't make me get Denvir to do a content dump of mature content involved in Morrowind! I think the website capacity is something like 15TB.

... Not that children ever played Morrowind. It was only Oblivion and after that children played it. I've heard stories of children rage-quitting on the Xbox because of Morrowind.

LASentry

Bottom line, TES games don't feel like they are for mature audiences.

Bottom line; that's your opinion. The reasons I gave and the official age ratings seem to disagree. I'd rather not get in an argument, but its pretty obvious where Bethesda was looking for an audience.

Have you read some of the books in these games? No, not Lusty Argonian Maid, though that's a valid comparison. Like "The Real Barenziah," where there's explicit Dunmer/Khajiit sex, or the relationship between Vivec and Molag Bal.

But like I said in my initial post: this can all be solved with a simple vote. This thread has lasted for nearly a week and all we've achieved is running around in circles. Unless I missed something. We should make an official voting thread (Does this site support poll formats?) let it run for a few days so everyone can send their responses, and then close the issue once and for all.

Just my opinion anyway. It seems like the most logical choice.

But those aren't even big deals, they're such minor things. It's not like there are whore houses everywhere and the worst word I have heard is "bitch". Besides, if something was in the original game, I don't see why it should be taken out. And I just mean that a child can play Oblivion or Skyrim and have fun and understand it for the most part, but the same cannot be said for Morrowind or Fallout.

I never said they were a big deal, but they're not alone either. It isn't just vulgarity and "mature" content, its the scope and themes of the games; Bethesda has created a mythos that obviously does not cater to children or the emotionally similar. War, racism, sexuality, ponderous political machinations, religious feuds and a fairly sophisticated character system all beg for a more mature, patient player. These are the things that give the games the ratings the have, and rightly so in my opinion.

They might end up in the hands of the woefully uninvested kid or dude-bro wanting to know what everyone is talking about, but that certainly isn't their target audience.

And all of this flies in the face of the fact that you and I agree on the point of this thread: that Molag Bal should be entitled to have his penis. At least, that's what I got from your comment on the second page.

Yeah that's really true... but think of this, children these days are so exposed to things like that that to be honest it's just part of every day life so it's pretty much the norm. Yeah, I don't think there's any reason to take it out of the game. To be honest I wish this thread was locked, it's so pointless.

Two things we agree on; I'm surprised its lasted this long.

And I can't argue the idea that its quickly become normal exposure, but I still like to fight it if I can. I remember when I was a kid (okay... a smaller kid) and my head was in the clouds; pretending I was a pirate on the flaming seas, or a vampire that loved to sing in a castle in the sky. I want more magic for kids, more Redwall and less GTA.

I really hate this karma system...

I know this is OT, but is there a guide or something on how this karma system works? Do you have to reach a certain level before you can leave karma?  EDIT: my computer was acting weird. All working now, but I agree with LASentry: I too don't quite like the karma system.

OnT: A lot of good comments on both sides so far. Has anyone seen the original creator though, or is he gone?

Solution: He is the God of Rape, Have his statue raping a woman.

Either her ass is being held against his crotch, and he's forcefully holding her against him.
or there's a woman forced on her knees, with Molag's hand on the back of her *head* down there, if you catch my drift.

That way it depicts rape, whilst covering his problematic phallus and daedric balls of epic steel. 

Shall we move on now?

@MatthewShine: WTF? I sincerely hope that was sarcasm, because between nudity and graphic depiction of rape for the lulz, the penis is definitely the lesser of two evils.

@MatthewShine

If you really are serious, I think that's waaay over the top. Now it's not just suggesting that he is the God of Rape, now it's just a statue of rape.

CORR

 I want more magic for kids, more Redwall and less GTA.

 

But Redwall has tons of awesome battles in it :D

Part of it was a joke, but cover up the womens body in "cloth" (stone of course) and everything is censored. Then, it 100% depicts that, "Hey, that is the God of Rape." 

We're all mature adults, (I think) and this is Molag Bal, a Daedric Lord of Rape. If Molag Bal is covered with a womans body, and the woman is covered.. we have the nudity problem covered.

or the artists could create an entirely new statue depicting him harvesting souls somehow.

I just want the team to focus on more important things, those were my solutions for the M rated game.

Making something controversial more-so isn't really the best plan. Not to mention that the extra work for the already taxed asset creators would be unnecessary. Seriously; I don't understand how any of that could be considered an option. Sorry.

The statue Niflhelm has nearly completed is wonderful work, and should remain. Regardless of whether or not it gains a penis.

Just put the penis, no rape or anything like that. This is so simple, I wish this thread was never created.

Honestly, I think that we should just leave it out. The best reason being that the whole thing is just a nod to the lore and was never put into the original game or and others for that matter; Along with the fact that some people are highly offended by it.

We can argue on and on about how society has accepted violence and not nudity but it wont change how people were brought up. Lets just take the safe route and leave it out. Some may suggest we make it an add-on but if we continue on this route with making everything add-ons, we will end up having to go through 150 add-ons [External image]. Hopefully everyone can atleast understand and accept these points so we can finally end this ridiculous argument that may have driven Niflhelm away...[External image]

This is TOTALLY what it should be like lol: [External image]

Glad to see you're taking this seriously. 

CORR

Glad to see you're taking this seriously. 

Lighten up mate [External image]....This crap has been going on for so long all i can do is laugh at it now.

I just wish people would let this die out, the creator of the Molag Bal model has been gone since this argument started so even if it comes to an agreement, there is nobody to put the phallus on the statue, or decide not to include it anyway 

I think whether or not it has the genitalia it shouldn't effect the overall work done on Skywind. I mean I don't care if it's there or not, it's not that big of a deal to me at least, but it's really up to the creator of the statue. Have him decide first, then the major developers should talk it over to come up with a final decision.

P.S: I would suggest to not do full out rape on the statue that might be pushing it, it should be heavily implied but not in-your-face as that creates a whole new level of controversy. (This is a thread about his junk, not what he specifically does with it)  

(I am probably gonna receive so much criticism on this, but here I go...) Niflhelm has been gone for over a week, and his model is complete. We probably won't get any more if we scared him away, and it would be disrespectful for someone to tweak his work at this point. The arguments from both sides had valid and well presented points (or at least some of them), but as our star modeler is gone, I suggest that this topic be dropped and the statue left as is. Moderators, feel free to lock this page.

Shushine

CORR

Glad to see you're taking this seriously. 

Lighten up mate [External image]....This crap has been going on for so long all i can do is laugh at it now.

I just wanna add...

LASentryBottom line, TES games don't feel like they are for mature audiences.

That is simply not true. All games Bethesda made after 2006 didn't. That's not all TES games and neither does Morrowind fall under that category. FO3, when we compare it to the previous two is just a piece of candy crap. Luckily Obsidian fixed that with New Vegas. Oblivion looked like a Disneyland and had no depth to it, some side quests might've been fun but it's entirety just didn't add up to make a believable world. In Skyrim it's much better, we even get some vague politics, and a bit harsher setting, but nothing too mature. Gameplay - wise both Oblivion and Skyrim with level scalling, compass, quest markers and all those other hand holding devices generally stray from what makes a good game, towards what makes a more accessible game for impatient players who feel repelled when they're forced to think at all. Not sure why they even added puzzles in Skyrim, if their difficulty level was comparable to this. All that combined with gore and extreme bruatlity. Pretty sickening mix if you ask me, like if someone was butchering a pig in the middle of a playground rather than in a butchery.

Morrowind on the other hand was paradoxally with it's low PEGI rating aimed much more at adult players. It had very deep lore, lots of stuff to discover, and very often forced you to think hard about anything you're doing. Daggerfall had it even better, with it's complex story that had 6 different endings and pretty hardcore gameplay. Morrowind is the game we are recreating. It did NOT feel like a game that wasn't aimed at mature audiences, and neither should Skywind in my opinion. If there is adult stuff in the books and dialogue, there should be adult stuff in graphical contents too.

I digress a bit, but I feel like some people don't have the right idea what TES was like before Oblivion.

Actually i think Bethesda games are most about bloodthirsty maniac in gruesome world.

Personage/protagonist (whatever in Skyrim, Morrowind or Fallout) expected to slaughter more human enemies than exist in world as neutral/good NPC. Games' worlds contains such atrocities as dead bodies hanging on a hooks (in really big %s to living population too). It filled with slaving, violence to the strange-behaviour (i think its rabies) animals, prostitution and drugs.

I am sure that artists can allow themselves some additional strokes it that direction.

Agreed

Dragomir

 PEGI 12.

 

Come on, that was ESRB back then

Optional addon. It should be the choice of the player to play the uncensored or censored version. Just like players could choose to play with better bodies or not in morrowind. Aside from the work required to add the option into the installer and to create the additional assets theres no reason it shouldn't be there.

Really? Why is this thread not locked yet?

It is now.