Morroblivion

Clearly its not marketed at a younger audience with the ratings. Bethesda would have spent an enormous amount of time considering what their market would be. Seems that they hit a good spot with the PEGI 18, sales didn't hurt.

I thought they were pretty obviously marketed toward older people: their setting, heavy dialogue and rich RPG elements clearly indicate a more in-depth, slower placed game; something usually reserved for people mature enough to enjoy.

When I said "teenagers" I did mean 15+, but even if younger children play them, that's their parent's problem. Age ratings exist for a reason, so no one should truly get upset if mature content appears in a mature game.

And really; this is pretty light in terms of what is considered "mature."

Bottom line, TES games don't feel like they are for mature audiences.

Don't make me get Denvir to do a content dump of mature content involved in Morrowind! I think the website capacity is something like 15TB.

LASentry wrote:

Bottom line, TES games don't feel like they are for mature audiences.

Bottom line; that's your opinion. The reasons I gave and the official age ratings seem to disagree. I'd rather not get in an argument, but its pretty obvious where Bethesda was looking for an audience.

Have you read some of the books in these games? No, not Lusty Argonian Maid, though that's a valid comparison. Like "The Real Barenziah," where there's explicit Dunmer/Khajiit sex, or the relationship between Vivec and Molag Bal.

But like I said in my initial post: this can all be solved with a simple vote. This thread has lasted for nearly a week and all we've achieved is running around in circles. Unless I missed something. We should make an official voting thread (Does this site support poll formats?) let it run for a few days so everyone can send their responses, and then close the issue once and for all.

Just my opinion anyway. It seems like the most logical choice.

I never said they were a big deal, but they're not alone either. It isn't just vulgarity and "mature" content, its the scope and themes of the games; Bethesda has created a mythos that obviously does not cater to children or the emotionally similar. War, racism, sexuality, ponderous political machinations, religious feuds and a fairly sophisticated character system all beg for a more mature, patient player. These are the things that give the games the ratings the have, and rightly so in my opinion.

They might end up in the hands of the woefully uninvested kid or dude-bro wanting to know what everyone is talking about, but that certainly isn't their target audience.

And all of this flies in the face of the fact that you and I agree on the point of this thread: that Molag Bal should be entitled to have his penis. At least, that's what I got from your comment on the second page.

Two things we agree on; I'm surprised its lasted this long.

And I can't argue the idea that its quickly become normal exposure, but I still like to fight it if I can. I remember when I was a kid (okay... a smaller kid) and my head was in the clouds; pretending I was a pirate on the flaming seas, or a vampire that loved to sing in a castle in the sky. I want more magic for kids, more Redwall and less GTA.

I know this is OT, but is there a guide or something on how this karma system works? Do you have to reach a certain level before you can leave karma?  EDIT: my computer was acting weird. All working now, but I agree with LASentry: I too don't quite like the karma system.

OnT: A lot of good comments on both sides so far. Has anyone seen the original creator though, or is he gone?

@MatthewShine: WTF? I sincerely hope that was sarcasm, because between nudity and graphic depiction of rape for the lulz, the penis is definitely the lesser of two evils.

CORR wrote:

 I want more magic for kids, more Redwall and less GTA.

 

But Redwall has tons of awesome battles in it :D

Making something controversial more-so isn't really the best plan. Not to mention that the extra work for the already taxed asset creators would be unnecessary. Seriously; I don't understand how any of that could be considered an option. Sorry.

The statue Niflhelm has nearly completed is wonderful work, and should remain. Regardless of whether or not it gains a penis.

Honestly, I think that we should just leave it out. The best reason being that the whole thing is just a nod to the lore and was never put into the original game or and others for that matter; Along with the fact that some people are highly offended by it.

We can argue on and on about how society has accepted violence and not nudity but it wont change how people were brought up. Lets just take the safe route and leave it out. Some may suggest we make it an add-on but if we continue on this route with making everything add-ons, we will end up having to go through 150 add-ons . Hopefully everyone can atleast understand and accept these points so we can finally end this ridiculous argument that may have driven Niflhelm away...

Glad to see you're taking this seriously. 

I just wish people would let this die out, the creator of the Molag Bal model has been gone since this argument started so even if it comes to an agreement, there is nobody to put the phallus on the statue, or decide not to include it anyway 

(I am probably gonna receive so much criticism on this, but here I go...) Niflhelm has been gone for over a week, and his model is complete. We probably won't get any more if we scared him away, and it would be disrespectful for someone to tweak his work at this point. The arguments from both sides had valid and well presented points (or at least some of them), but as our star modeler is gone, I suggest that this topic be dropped and the statue left as is. Moderators, feel free to lock this page.

I just wanna add... LASentry wrote:

Bottom line, TES games don't feel like they are for mature audiences.

That is simply not true. All games Bethesda made after 2006 didn't. That's not all TES games and neither does Morrowind fall under that category. FO3, when we compare it to the previous two is just a piece of candy crap. Luckily Obsidian fixed that with New Vegas. Oblivion looked like a Disneyland and had no depth to it, some side quests might've been fun but it's entirety just didn't add up to make a believable world. In Skyrim it's much better, we even get some vague politics, and a bit harsher setting, but nothing too mature. Gameplay - wise both Oblivion and Skyrim with level scalling, compass, quest markers and all those other hand holding devices generally stray from what makes a good game, towards what makes a more accessible game for impatient players who feel repelled when they're forced to think at all. Not sure why they even added puzzles in Skyrim, if their difficulty level was comparable to this. All that combined with gore and extreme bruatlity. Pretty sickening mix if you ask me, like if someone was butchering a pig in the middle of a playground rather than in a butchery.

Morrowind on the other hand was paradoxally with it's low PEGI rating aimed much more at adult players. It had very deep lore, lots of stuff to discover, and very often forced you to think hard about anything you're doing. Daggerfall had it even better, with it's complex story that had 6 different endings and pretty hardcore gameplay. Morrowind is the game we are recreating. It did NOT feel like a game that wasn't aimed at mature audiences, and neither should Skywind in my opinion. If there is adult stuff in the books and dialogue, there should be adult stuff in graphical contents too.

I digress a bit, but I feel like some people don't have the right idea what TES was like before Oblivion.

Agreed

Optional addon. It should be the choice of the player to play the uncensored or censored version. Just like players could choose to play with better bodies or not in morrowind. Aside from the work required to add the option into the installer and to create the additional assets theres no reason it shouldn't be there.

It is now.